Master chain link... riveted vs clip

[Charlie98]

I bought a new chain and sprocket set for the Monster, the chain came with a rivet-type master link... and I don't have a rivet tool.  I've always used clip links, even on my CBR1000, and never had problems... is there any issue using a clip link on the Ducati with a SSS?

Rivet tool: $75

Clip link: $5

...so you see the difference, in a tool I would likely only use twice or thrice...

Normally I wouldn't ask such a dumb question, but I've found with Ducati is... you never know with Ducati.   

[Speeddog]

I used clip links without incident for decades, but I treated the link with respect, as that's all there was so one had to make them work.....

As long as you don't brutalize the clip on install, it's installed the correct direction, and you don't fuxxor it afterward while cleaning or the like, they're fine.
In my experience, not everyone can do that.

The clip links I've used in the last 20 years require the side plate to be pressed on, the same as the rivet links.
I'm sure that the pin and sideplate dimensions are the same, other than the end of the pin that is either grooved for a clip or hollow-tipped to be swaged out.
About every 2nd year I see a clip-linked chain that shows the press fit is adequate to do the job, as it comes in my shop without a clip.....

The biggest issue I've seen with any master links is inadequate/improper lube at assembly.
I've seen chains that are otherwise fine, but the pins on the master link are worn halfway through.
If the clip didn't come with a little packet of grease, then you have to find one.
Do your best to get as much of that grease inside as possible.
Don't press the sideplate on too far, that'll kill the O-rings.
You can flare the ends of the pins on a rivet link with a hammer and punch.
It's a bit awkward with a SSS as you've got to have a solid support from the ground to react the hammering.
A good caliper is very helpful to confirm proper sideplate position and adequate pin flare.

I only install clip links if the customer specifically requests it, and they always get a lecture on what their responsibilities are.

[ducpainter]

Use a block of steel on the pins of the link to back it up while hammering. Works great.

Ever see the Three Stooges episode where Curly had a back up helmet?

[Charlie98]

The ones I've done previously, even on my 1000, I've packed the links full of grease.  Granted, I've never really looked at one when I pulled it after it's service life... that's interesting.  I just wanted to make sure there wasn't something with the SSS that would catch, or some close tolerance somewhere.  I might give the rivet a try... I have a 3# sledge I can use as a backer, and a rivet punch.  Worth a try, I suppose...

[ducpainter]

The ones I've done previously, even on my 1000, I've packed the links full of grease.  Granted, I've never really looked at one when I pulled it after it's service life... that's interesting.  I just wanted to make sure there wasn't something with the SSS that would catch, or some close tolerance somewhere.  I might give the rivet a try... I have a 3# sledge I can use as a backer, and a rivet punch.  Worth a try, I suppose...

As long as you have 3 hands...

[Mhanis]

I have a rivet tool at the house, you are welcome to drop by and pick it up when you are in the neighborhood, it is one of the Motion Pro ones.

Mark

[Charlie98]

Thank you, Mark!  I will take you up on that...

I've got a short week this week... I'm headed back out to NV to drive my wife (and the XR650) back home, I'll shoot you a text when I get back next week!

I was looking at it last night... I think I can do it without the tool, but the idea of the chain coming apart has me repeating one of my axioms:  'The right tool for the right job.'  A popped chain would certainly render the Monster to parts on eBay...

[Charlie98]

As a follow up... and a few general questions...

Mark was kind enough to loan me his rivet tool... I've not put my eye out with it (yet) and even managed to rivet my chain together.  I'm not real happy with the results... one of the O-rings pushed out of the side plate, and I may have applied the rivet a little too much (in typical Charlie98 fashion.  Nothing exceeds like excess!)

I stopped by the Honda dealer yesterday to grab a few extry links... he didn't have any.  But as we were talking, he said a few things that had me scratching my head...

1)  Master links are proprietary... an RK link will not fit a DID, etc, etc.  I assumed 525 chain dimensions were all the same... but he said a few years ago everyone modified their dimensions, so they don't now.  That true?

2)  I asked him if the replacement link was a clip or rivet... he said rivet!!!  All clip links will fail!!!  As I stated in my OP, I've used clip links for a zillion years, at least, even including on my CBR1000, which has a few more horsepower than my Ducati does (and a 530 chain, too, I believe.)  Knowing about the design and how a clip link works... I'm not sure where that is coming from.  As Dog mentioned, the clip has to be installed correctly and not reused... I got that (which is why I always have spares.)

Just curious.  Mechanic's opinions are like noses, they all have one and pick them for different reasons, much of it likely based on experience and such, and I don't argue about stuff like that, anymore.  But like the whole Ducati motor oil debate, or who makes the best tire, I'm just looking for opinions... and, preferably, experience... about drive chains.  I've got 2 more links coming, and I'll re-rivet my chain... being more careful about how I'm doing it... but knowledge is power.

[Speeddog]

If it pushed the o-ring out, yes, it's a do-over.

1) Yes, that's true, links are not necessarily interchangeable amongst manufacturers.
    AFAIK, only pitch, gap between inner plates, and roller diameter are standardized.

2) "All clip links will fail!"
    That's pure unadulterated garbage.
    I used clip links exclusively for 30 years because for most of that time that's all there was.
    Up until sometime in the late '80's/early 90's, clip link removable sideplates were a slip fit on the pins.
    Then they were re-sized so that you had to press the sideplate on just like rivet links.
    Not sure if that was industry wide, but I suspect so.
    I was running my Bonneville/El-Mirage racer at that time, and I wanted a clip link, and not with a pressed on sideplate.
    So I reamed out the holes in the sideplate.
    Worked fine on a nitrous-fed Yamaha V-twin that got me in the 200 club.

[Charlie98]

If it pushed the o-ring out, yes, it's a do-over.

Kind of figured that... which was why I was trying to get some more links.  The proprietary dimensions thing is new, however... good to know.