Ducati Monster Forum

   Just finished the Ti frame for my S4RS:
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01047.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01035.jpg)

 :o. Holy crap!  I think I need a little private time ....

Beautiful indeed... Can't wait to see it in person at DucStock

get that build thread up already!

that frame is just so damn sexy....

what's the weight on it?

Damn!!! What? You work for NCR on the side? [cheeky] Very nice and then some!! [clap] [thumbsup]

 It weighs 15lbs. The stock frame weighed 27lbs. I probably could have went with a thinner wall on some of the tube and saved a little more weight, but I didn't want it to feel like a piece of spaghetti either. It will be interesting to see what the dry weight of the complete bike will be. After building the frame and weighing different parts it makes me wonder about some of the dry weights I've seen. Anyway I'm shootin for 350lbs dry, but don't know if I'll make it without CF wheels.

Can't wait for DucStock....lots of work left. I'll start a build thread soon.

I just can't stop staring at it.    [drool]

How is the rigidity compared to stock? Or is that something you only know once you get the bike together? :P

wow! [clap]

Nice.  [thumbsup]

Impressive.   [thumbsup]

Seriously?
F'ing impressive. [bow_down]

I use to have a Ti Moots mountain bike, something magical about this stuff.
A Ti Monster, mmm, good.

Very nice!!  [bow_down]

wholy crap dude!!! 

nice welds on that frame.  i forgot did you say you worked at litespeed/merlin bicycles for a while?

damn nice job  that should look sweet when its done.

+1
 
Beautiful work!!  And effing impressive [thumbsup]

 [clap] [clap] [clap]

UNFF!!!

 [bow_down]

Amazing!!

Sweet! [thumbsup]

Looks like it might take up a lot of space in you garage. I would gladly take that burden off your hands. PM me if it interested.  ;D

Beautiful........

Anxiously awaiting more details [thumbsup]


 [popcorn]

(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01055.jpg)

 [bacon] [clap]
That thing looks cleeeeaaaaaaaannnnnnnnnnnn!!!!!!!!!!

I need details on that tail section. Where do I get one?
Nice work man!  [thumbsup]

Dude....  [drool]

Very nice indeed. Great job so far and what is the deal with that tail section?

The only thing this picture needs is a step ladder to go with that chain [cheeky]

That is gonna be very nice!!

  Thanks for all of the compliments guys!
  
  I made the tail also. I had a vision of what I wanted this bike to look like, kind of cafe racerish, but I didn't want one of those cafe tails that don't fit very well. So I carved the tail out of foam, covered it with fiberglass and made a mold for the CF. Unfortunately when I pulled a vacuum on the mold some of the CF moved and the weave in some places is not straight. So, I am going to paint this one black with silver stripe to match the tank. I hope to offer these in the future if I can get the weave straight on the CF. I could also do them in fiberglass, either primed or painted. I made a CF clutch cover also but it's not done yet. The seat pad was done but I didn't like the look so it's going back to be redone.

  Yeah, it looks clean....I hate to put the wiring back

 [clap] [clap] [clap]

Damn that's hot
[clap]


More pics please!
[popcorn]

That looks fantastic!  [drool]

You'll get your goal.  I revamped my 96 M900 several years ago, just nipping and tucking at the (stock) frame, powder coated it afterwards.  Rewired, replaced stock bits with aluminum or composite, magnesium wheels and weighed in at 380 lbs. with a completely full tank and 4qts oil.  Then again, it did have a 7a/h battery, when it needed the extra oomph of the 12 a/h.

 [thumbsup] Great looking frame and very cool seat.  What did you do with the VIN #?

Wow, absolutely amazing piece of fabrication.  This is leagues beyond the ham fisted stuff on the bike build tv shows.  I've always lusted after a nice Indy Fab Ti hardtail mountain bike.

ummm...WOW!

Is there a nomination process for 'Hero Member' status?

That is f'n gorgeous - can't wait for the final presentation.
 [clap] [clap] [clap]

I was wondering that too...

Custom made frame would mean a custom made bike, and would probably qualify for a brand spankin new vin as it is technically, at this point, a new bike.  Much like building a kit car or chopper.

wow.......I'm currently rebuilding my cromo and just finished stripping and cutting tabs on the frame and then getting it powdercoated. Your Ti frame just looks so much more beautiful...........I am seriously jealous.


That tail is damn sexy too.


awesome work!

Makes sense, thanks Punx!

....but is it straight?  ;D

That tail section is icing on the cake.  Beautiful, man.  If you have to paint it leave some showing in the paint design.

^^^  What howie said!


 [bow_down] [bow_down] [bow_down] [bow_down] [bow_down] [drool] [drool] [drool] [drool] [drool] [bacon] [bacon] [bacon] [bacon] [bacon] [bacon] [bacon] [clap] [clap] [clap] [clap] [clap] [clap] [clap] [thumbsup] [thumbsup] [thumbsup] [thumbsup] [thumbsup] [thumbsup] [thumbsup] [thumbsup] [thumbsup]

Beautiful.  [clap] 

ArcFab (Doug Cook) used to make Ti frames for Supersports. His complete bikes were extremely light. Your welds look even better than his.

Dougs frames were about 9 ish pounds with bearing races.

Ever see either in person?

This is obviously quality work ,but pictures can lie...just sayin'.

I was wondering if the frame has been blasted or glass beaded, or if it was welded in a chamber?

No doubt those welds were shielded REALLY well :) [thumbsup]

   OK, I'll try to answer some of the questions:
 
    Is it rigid enough: I think so. The main tubes from the head to the engine mounts are 1.25" and the wall is .005" thicker than the stock frame. Ti is stronger than steel but a little more flexible so you can't just substitute Ti for steel and get the same stiffness. I also had all of the gussets cut with a water jet from 1/8" plate.

   VIN#: In the state of Kansas I just have to have it inspected by the Highway Patrol and they will issue a new VIN#. If I want to sell the frames I need to issue a MSO. There is no federal regulation on frames, it is up to each state. Some states require that the MSO come from a bonded company. In Kansas all you need is a bill of sale to get a VIN# for a frame. I have found a company that will sell you VIN#'s for frames. It's $1,400 for the first VIN and $200 for each one after that.

 DucPainter:The frame was not welded in a chamber. I used a gas lens in the torch and 10 seconds post purge with UHP Argon. I only welded 3/4 to 1" at a time to stay within the coverage of the gas lens. I also injected argon inside the tube in the places that I could. If you look close in the picture below you can see where I screwed a fitting into the jig to purge the inside of the head tube. That head tube is machined from a piece of Ti pipe, not a thin piece of tube with an aluminum insert.

IMO,pictures usually make welds look worse than they actually are,especially on shiny metal.

The frame was not beadblasted.I buffed the weld area off with a Scotchbrite wheel and then sanded with some 320 paper and then a Scotcbrite pad. A thin coat of WD-40 makes it look nice.
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/IMAGE_092.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/IMAGE_106.jpg)

What's it called when you're intensely jealous to the point nearing anger?

That's pretty awesome. I dream of being at this level of, but alas I'm only in the process of learning my mig whilst saving for a tig. So I have to ask: is this type of thing near your profession or entirely a hobby?

I was wondering how you removed the discoloration.

There would be some with even a ten second post flow.

The Ti pipe is the expensive way to do it. [thumbsup]

a duc owner that's looking this frame haha

I approve of this frame.

i though about buying somebodies ARC Ti frame but i kinda didn't like the weird redesign he did by the headtube. i sure it was partially due to not having any bent/angled tubes. all straights. i would love to own a ti or aluminum monster frame and Rmartin's has the cleanest one i've seen hands down. i'm eager to see a price on the final product if he's going to sell and i'm not saying just to harass the guy. can't rush perfection.

it'd be awesome if Rmartin is going to be at indy GP.

Wow. Watching with interest.

thats a nice looking jig you've built there.

Holy Sh*t! That is AMAZING!!!! I work with Ti on airplanes and it can be a dog. I wonder how much of a difference bead blasting would make?  Not only in the appearance but the actual structural strengthening and stress relief that bead blasting has on metal.  [clap] [beer] [bow_down] [drool]  [bacon]

I think everyone else has used up all the superlatives, so I have nothing left to add

except...

can you teach me to weld that good?   ;D

Holy crap! Another forum member from my state!

That must make a whole three or four of us here...

Great work, I really love/engy it! [thumbsup]


So, have you put any thought in making a few more frames and sellling them? [evil]

words are useless!

 [beer]

   Zarn - Where are you located in Kansas?

Yes, they will be for sale, just not quite ready to let the whole cat out of the bag yet.

I dare you to make a frame for a Sport1000.   [evil]

Just make sure you're actually making them out of titanium and not unobtanium

 ;DSo how much is Titanium and how much is Unobtanium? I think NCR's frames are $15k....mine will be lower than that.@

I'll give ya 5 dollars.

I guess that is less than 15k....hmmm

 [thumbsup] [thumbsup] [thumbsup]!!!

 [popcorn]

Great project [thumbsup]

Just a friendly word of advice if you're going to sell these. . .

talk to your agent about a minimum of a $1M liability policy.  You'll need it.

Want...want...want...
Great work!  [thumbsup]

Been watching......I like this....  :P [thumbsup]

nice work...   [thumbsup]

I'd be interested when you come to sell em..

Same here.

wasn't there a story about one of his frames cracking?

Great job! This frame is the work of art!
But how practical is it? Titanium has a low fatigue strength and will stretch and loose it's geometry after a couple of seasons. That's what happens to NCR titanium frames - you ride for a couple of seasons then put it in your house as an example of beautiful engineering.

You mean internet bullshit?  ;)

One that crashed into a bridge ripped the tubes from the steering head.

The welds didn't fail. The material was stressed beyond it's capabilities.

I posted at the time the frame and it's welds were not designed to be crashed into a bridge abutment...I stand by that statement.

that would be the story ;)

 [bang]

really?

15K for a couple of seasons?

must be more of that internet bullshit?

What?  A motorcycle frame that is not capable of withstanding a crash into a bridge abutment?  Unbelievable! 

Tell me about it.  [roll]

Not exactly first hand experience, but I have seen examples at local Ducati dealer who is also building custom bikes. I personally know the owners.

 There are 29 different grades of Ti. I used Grade 9, which is what NCR and Doug used and most bicycle frames are made of. This is used primarily for aircraft hydraulic lines. I don't think that would be an application for low fatigue strength.
  Here's some info on Ti.
 You are somewhat limited in what tubing you can buy. You can get thinwall Gr9 pretty easy, but if you want something thicker it's more difficult. That's why I had the headpiece machined out of a piece of Gr5 pipe. That piece of 7" pipe was $180 and another $80 to machine it. From the pictures I saw it looked like Doug used a piece of thinwall tubing with an aluminum insert for the bearing races. That's probably why his frames were mitered going to the head tubes, the tubing was too thin to bend. Not knocking his frames, that's just how he built them.
  Grade 9 has 3% Aluminum and 2.5% Vanadium. Grade 5 has 6% Aluminum and 4% Vanadium. So if you build your frame from Gr9, guess what, you can't buy Gr9 plate for the gussetts. So you have to weld Gr9 to Gr5. Which isn't a big problem, you just have to choose which filler to use. You would think since they use all of this tubing for hydraulic lines that you could get Gr9 filler pretty easy. Nope.....I found one supplier for Gr9 filler, and it was over $600lb. So I talked with a couple of the bicycle manufacturers and they use Gr5 ELI rod which is slightly over $100lb. Also you need to use Ultra High Purity Argon for a shielding gas. I went through 2 1/2 bottles at @ $180 a bottle.
  I wanted to build a Ti exhaust for this bike but I really didn't have time and finding someone to bend thinwall tube didn't work out.
I got a quote to bend 1- 180 degree elbow from 2" Gr2 Ti tubing with a .049 wall. $1,400!! For 1 elbow. The wife wasn't going for that.LOL
 I hope you guys found this informative and I hope it somewhat explains the high cost of Ti parts. I didn't mention that you also have to consider that Ti takes longer to cut and machine and you use more cutting ,machining materials. I don't think you will ever see "cheap" Ti frames.

  As far as NCR frames welds cracking, I guess it's possible. Can someone name a manufacturer that hasn't had cracked welds at some point?









 

That claim about the fatigue strength of Ti sounds like pure BS to me.  This is true of Al, but not steel, carbon, or Ti.

This is why you can buy springs made of steel, carbon, and Ti, but not Al.

In any case, it's also why motorcycles have suspensions on 'em.

One of the big things an engineer learns in machine design is fatigue.  The honest to goodness truth of the matter is that steel is the ONLY material that can be designed for an infinite life span.  The material properties of every metal degrade over time, but steel is the only one that approaches something other than zero.  Aluminum, Ti, whatever, will all become weaker over time due to stress cycles, and will eventually fail.  Period.

As for the suspension... your front forks do nothing to alleviate torque about the steering head from cornering or just the fact that motorcycles have a rake.

At the moment I'm choosing the frame for my S4Rt project - the guys who build and guys who ride titanium framed bikes told me these details. So my choice is carbon, Al - second place, Ti - not an option.

IMHO Ti frames are purely commercial - just to have something exotic and rare in the catalog and make some $$$. Customers who buy them are aware of this.

There are alloys of Ti that exhibit a theoretical fatigue limit below which continued loading does not lead to structural failure.  I'm not an expert on this, but the choice of Ti for a valve spring material reinforces the notion that a properly-engineered solution can manage 10^6+ cycles before failure.

In the bicycle world, Ti frames are not considered to have a limited service life, but in the motorcycle world where the forces are a lot higher it might be a different story.  It seems to me that if the frame is designed for sufficient stiffness it should be able to stay well below the fatigue limit for an extremely long time - not just a couple of seasons.

Al is more susceptible to fatigue than Ti, and I don't see people worrying about fatigue in Al frames, wheels, or swingarms.

  I agree Syscrush...that's why my frame is a little heavier than other Ti frames you might have seen. Ti is not a magic metal. Like I said before, I don't think you can substitute Ti for Steel and end up with the same result. Mines a little beefiier. I wouldn't build a 9lb frame.
  I am curious about the NCR SBK frame. It appears to be the same O.D. as the stock frame. I wonder if the wall is thicker.
Also, how many people ride hard enough to feel a frame flex. Don't want to step on any toes but how many people on this board can ride a bike to it's limits? I know I can't....OK, maybe right before I crash ;D

  Good discussion....

<subscribed>

There is a trade off that you have to make.  Sure, a steel frame will be heavier, but I can guarantee an infinite (90% certainty) life if it's built right.  The Ti frame could be designed to last a long time and be light, but I would never say infinite life time with 90% certainty.  Personally, I would prefer a lightened chromoly steel frame to a Ti frame.  Costs would be lower, lifetime would be longer, and the chromoly frame wouldn't be too much heavier.

As for the aluminum frames... looking at my swingarm, the aluminum is quite thick.  To make a similar trellis style frame out of aluminum that would last, the tube walls would have to be pretty thick too.  The question is, would it be cost or weight effective to build an aluminum tube copy of the trellis frame we all know and love?

It sounds like RMartin is taking the more balanced, longer life approach, to a Ti frame.

What about this cromolly? (spelling??)

What about this cromolly? (spelling??) = steel

That's not exotic  ???

Reason I ask is I was offered a custom frame while entertaining the idea of an oversized Monster (matching me)

chromoly steel has a much higher strength to weight ratio than plain steel, while still being able to machine, weld, and bend easily.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/41xx_steel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/41xx_steel)

Want to get silly with steel?

http://reynoldstechnology.biz/our_materials_953.php (http://reynoldstechnology.biz/our_materials_953.php)

Monsterize an ST for a larger bike.

  Some of the bicycle builder told me about some new lighter weight steels they were going to start experimenting with.

  I don't think I would want a CF frame. Hell, even Rossi can't ride one of those ;)

how about magnesium for a frame?

Yeh but Stoner can [cheeky]

Yes, the walls would have to be quite thick, and the tubes should probably have significantly larger OD as well so that the stiffness is high enough to prevent flexing which will induce fatigue.  We already know what a successful Al trellis frame looks like:

its just beautiful...  [clap]

Yes, but strength isn't a very significant issue on frames, I.E. we see *very* few frames break or fail in normal service.

A more appropriate spec to look at is Specific Modulus; the stiffness to weight ratio.
A heap of info here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Specific_modulus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Specific_modulus)

Examining it for even remotely suitable frame materials, you find....

Steel, magnesium, aluminum, and titanium all have essentially the same specific stiffness, 25x10⁶ m²s⁻².

So if you want to reduce frame weight, with the same physical layout/design, you sacrifice stiffness.

so what you are saying... a way to reduce weight isn't trough material, but design.

Only carbon fiber seems to have a better stat in this regard...

Except glass(!) seems comparable to the various metals, so consider me confused.  ???

I'm guessing that the elasticity/ brittleness / fatigue would have to factor in somehow. Otherwise some fool would be building glass frames (Quick! Tell the 'hideous custom' guys about this. It's our chance to thin the herd!  ;D )

[edit] NM. I read a bit further:

Stiffness versus strength in bending

Note that the ultimate strength of a beam in bending depends on the ultimate strength of its material and its section modulus, not its stiffness and second moment of area. Its deflection, however, and thus its resistance to Euler buckling, will depend on these two latter values.

This all makes plenty of sense.  But you still run into issues of fatigue loading.  20 years down the road, steel will hold up, Al, Mg, and Ti will have failed.

My Seven mountain bike frame was Ti and I thought THAT was a work of art.  And that cost $4,000+ just for the frame....a BICYCLE frame.  And this was a few years back.  I can't imagine what a titanium motorcycle frame would cost. 

(http://i886.photobucket.com/albums/ac67/billyzoom1/Seven1.jpg)

She was a beauty!  Selling her off paid for my motorcycle gear and a few mods.... [evil]

Your frame is stunning.  Hope it's half as amazing as it looks. 

Joel

Awesome work!  imo the Ti will hold up fine -- it makes a perfectly good spring material (rear shock springs on all the factory MX bikes are Ti and they get hammered), it holds up exceedingly well in MTB use and there its really pushed to the limit of just how thin/light it can be without breaking.  Yours with the extra thickness will probably last 'till the next ice age -- I'd ride it [clap]  [clap]  [clap]  [clap]

You just pulled '20 years' out of thin air.....
I'm ten feet away from a 20 year old Honda, that has 20k miles on it, and it has an aluminum frame.
It's not broken.
As long as the operating stresses are below the limit for the number of stress cycles, failure is unlikely.

I'd be really surprised if the average lifespan of a bike was more than 30k miles.
Most die due to neglect or a crash before that.

Does anyone here have FHE with an aluminum frame cracking in normal service?
Or does anybody here know someone who did?

I do re aluminum (have physically seen friend's cracked frames), but it was due to faulty casting on one model year, not faulty engineering.  My frame, which is of the year that could be so afflicted, has 60k rather hard miles and no cracks.  The potential crack point is a rear shock mount.  It'll be irrelevant when I fit my fancy bitubo rear shock as its not even utilized by the bitubo.  Virtually all japanese bikes of the past two decades have aluminum frames.  Very few have cracking issues -- even ones used for stunting. 

For that matter my XR650R and CR250R have aluminum frames.  Both see impacts and forces way beyond what a street bike will see.  Try 120' jumps on a MX track or head-deep whoops at 70mph.  Both rock solid and crack-free (and both a decade old now).

This is key. As long as the stresses are well within the elastic range for the frame material, fatigue failure should be unlikely.

Plenty of things are made from aluminium and titanium (i.e aircraft wing structures) that have very long service lives under cyclic loading.

  Here's a pic of the bike on the scale. It did have oil in it. After I took the bike off I loaded up everything that goes back on the bike. I think it's going to end up 350-360 dry.
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01061.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01062.jpg)

Not true.  Even with steel, the "fatigue strength", if you will, is about half the yield strength.  Then you factor in scratches, squared edges, and any number of surface imperfections...


All of this is true.  I wouldn't be surprised if the design on the aluminum frames was such that some other component (probably engine / transmission) was designed to fail earlier.  But, ideally (ie, I was building a frame, not normal service) I would want to build it to last 100k miles, and be light.  5k a year isn't too much mileage is it?

[/off topic]

Back on topic...

Thats a fine looking machine you are building there.  Keep up the good work!

Sure it's true. Keep the stresses "well within" the elastic range and the material should be fine. I never defined if it was 1/2, 1/3, 1/4, etc. of the yield strength because I don't know and it depends on the specific material.  The point is, keep the stresses low enough (i.e. proper design for the material and its intended use and desired lifespan) and fatigue failure should be unlikely.

Commercial aircraft wings are a great example of an aluminum frame structure which experiences cyclic loadig over a long life span without failure. There is no reason the same cannot be done for a motorcycle frame (Aluminum, Titanium, whatever). Whether that frame would be lighter than steel is a different issue.

  I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that maybe there is not as much stress on a frame as what we think. There is very little penetration on those Mig welds on a Monster frame. You ever look at a Harley frame? Crap! My brother had a 74 Harley and I went over to his house one day when he had it apart. Those welds looked like something Macgyver welded with a car battery, a set of jumper cables and a piece of coat hanger for filler rod. :o
  I wish I could find the article interviewing one of Ducati's engineers. He was talking about how light they could make a frame on one of the earlier SBK's(correct me if I'm wrong). He said they would cut tubes out of the frame and send the test rider out on the bike. When the rider could feel the frame flex they welded one set of tubes back in and called it good. Interesting....

BTW: You mentioned you used a waterjet to cut the frame tubes or was that just done on the gussets?

If it was used to cut the tubes, was there any specific software you used to program the cuts?

   The waterjet was just on the gussetts.

This thread made me remember how nice it was to ride my Ti frame, so I took it out for a quick spin after work today...

(http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z53/b_upton/DSC_0064.jpg)

Are those carbon seat stays?  I assume that the fork and the seat post are carbon, too?

Agreed 100%.  Although, the little bit of materials science I know makes me feel a bit freaked when I look out the window at the Al wing of a 20+ year old plane and see it flexing like that.

actually they are inpected OFTEN and parts replaced as soon as sign of cracks show.

I don't think we would check our frames every few road hours for signs of wear and replace if any signs show.

As far as I know the wing structures of commercial planes aren't inspected often. I believe planes are torn down every 3 years, otherwise it's a superficial check of the skin, not the structural frame beneath.

Even if the inspetction is yearly, I wouldn't call that often given the number of oscillations a wing is exposed to over that time period...compared to what a moto frame would be exposed to.

Carbon for the forks, and both the seat stays and tube.  It's still got the alloy seat post that came with the frame set at the moment.

geez you guys have a lots of money nice seven cycles there guys..

I don't have any money; mainly because I spent it on nice toys.   ;D

I have an. Extra cf seat post.. pm me if interested..

Loving this thread by the way..

Getting everything back together....
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01088.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01086.jpg)

So very nice!

If you don't mind me asking. Where did you get the foam to shape the mold for the tail?

 You can buy the foam at Lowes or Home Depot that comes in 4x8 sheets and is 2 inches thick, it's about $25. I cut it into blocks and glued it together to make a block the size I needed. I used a hand saw to get the basic shape and then used the wifes electric knife for most of the carving ;D This stuff sands pretty smooth once you get the shape you want.
  Next I covered the foam with fiberglass and epoxy resin to make the mold. Don't use polyester resin, it will melt the foam.

   Here's a pic in the shaping process. As you can tell I made some changes along the way. The neat thing is that if you cut too much off, you can just glue a new piece back on and keep going. I'm sure there are some better techniques out there but this worked pretty well for me.
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/IMAGE_139.jpg)

I was exactly thinking about using that material. It's like panel insulation foam, but I'm sure theyre all about the same.

Thank you

You can also paint the foam with a few coats of surfacing primer, then sand smooth, wax, and make a negative mold with fibreglass.

I've used the blue foam for that kind of project, but it gouges really easily.

That looks like the pink foam, I recall someone telling me that the pink foam shaped better.

I think the difference is one is eps the other is xps.

Eps is like a bunch of little balls glued together. The xps is extruded as a sheet and doesn't have a grain structure

  Ti tail light bracket:
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01089.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01090.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01091.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01092.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01093.jpg)

This is beyond sick. I am super jealous of your impressive fab skills. Great work man.

Thanks!  Started out building resturant equipment ;D Built a ton of Pizza Hut's kitchen stuff. All of those sneeze guards over salad bars...kind of like a trellis frame.....

Very impressive work, I love everything that is over engineered or made as good as it can be, but I think the lisenceplate and lights would be securily attached if the bracket was made in aluminum ;)

  I think the only aluminum I have in the shop is some small pieces used for backing plates. I never did really like building things with aluminum.....no real reason. I do like the fact that aluminum can be anodized different colors. Ti can be anodized also...but you're limited on colors.
  Aluminum would sure be easier to drill and tap...

Beautiful work.

The foam you speak of, is it just insulation board? I've been giving  some thought as to building my own custom seat. A solo seat that resembles that of the 1098.

  Yes....Get the pink stuff.....2 inches thick....4x8 sheet. Good Luck!

Looking through this thread caused me to make a sticky spot in my uniform....make the beast with two backsing awesome is all I got but it ain't nearly enough!

  Getting close to being done!
 The bike weighs 364lbs dry....no water,oil, or battery. It fired up on the first push of the button ;D
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01101.jpg)
 
A few pics of the Ti headlight bracket. Gauges mounted under the triple, headlight lowered
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01094.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01096.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01095.jpg)

Tail section just painted this morning
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01103.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01102.jpg)

Should have some completed pics Monday

LOVED IT right up to the tail-light. 

You should check and see if you can get a Fleda unit to fit that tail section.

  Yeah, I didn't really want the tail light sticking out so far. It looks a lot better back under the tail. But if you move the light back under the tail then the license plate bracket sticks out past the light and that doesn't look good either. I guess the tail could be a bit longer....but the length looks about right.

Seriously, see if you can one of these to work on it.

Ducati FLEDA LEGACY Tail Light System (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QJBiWPuBgN4#)

how much weight could you save with the smaller Pace radiator and a single fan?

Agreed. You gotta do something better with the tail light. Everything else is just too awesome not to.

(http://www.partb.co.uk/data/372.jpg)

i agree, the rest of the bike is too pretty to have that taillight...

  Here a few pics of the finished bike. Done just in time to head to Ducstock on Wednesday. If you're going, look me up, I would love to meet some of the guys from the forum.
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01131.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01122.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/DSC01124.jpg)

 [clap] Congratulations. You should be proud.

No kidding! Looks really nice. Well, except for that one thing.   [cheeky]

Slap some light weight wheels on that puppy and you're done.

Stage 2 in my head:

Ti spring in back
Ti full exhaust
ti Swingarm
CF or lightweight OZ rims
rear LED light
Pace radiator
magnesium side cases
AL or CF tank
CF bodywork

Maybe he likes it as is.

I do.

  Yes, I like it like it is, but it would be nice to have an unlimited budget! The next owner can add whatever he wants to it.

looks awesome man, cant wait to see what you have coming together next

really beautiful..... the tail piece/seat pan looks great

What a beauty.  Well done.   [thumbsup]

Joel

  I already know what my next project is. Last x-mas I bought my wife a cool set of rally lights for the front of her Mini Cooper. I told her I'd make a light bar out of Ti. She just reminded me ;D

Here's a video clip.  This thing looks and sounds sick....

https://plus.google.com/u/0/107983688511342187573/posts/crnSRDzWWVB

  Hey MadDuc! It was great to meet you at Barber. We had a good time. Got to meet a few guys from the DMF and even got to talk to Paul Smart for a bit. Everyone there was very friendly (well except for the guy selling philly cheese steak sandwiches)  ;D.

Having seen Randy's bike at DucStock, I can testify that those pictures don't do it justice. If I had the money that thing would be under my ass right now and I wouldn't be typing this. 

Think I'll take my bike out for a beer right now. I need to feel wind with a goal.

So what kind of beer does your bike drink?

My bike drinks Mobil 1 and I enjoy the likes of New Belgium Trippel.

  We had some professional pics taken of the bike, this is one of my favorites:
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20S4RS/A079emailable.jpg)

Look great!  [clap]

  Thanks Steve!

Awesome work  [thumbsup]  I think CF wheels would set it off really nicely and they are oh-so-light you'll be amazed at how much quicker it turns.

Do they really make that much difference?

Nope, especially on Sport1K's, just throwing money down the drain.   ;D

for real, nothing beats spoked wheels that use tubes!  i mean, they are so light your view is nearly unobstructed when looking through it - can't say that about any of the Brembo / Marchesini 3/5/7/10 spokes! :P

 [laugh]

DRKWNG, I had no idea what your sig was about, just googled it and have been laughing my ass off for the last half hour or so.

It just keeps getting better.

Someone at work showed me the vid a few days ago.  I nearly pissed myself the first time I saw it.  It's still funny....

Where I'm from Mama gets a what-what, you know I represent.

The Rick Perry and Mitt Romney vids are just as hilarious.

 [thumbsup]

Beautiful work man. I sure would love a full trellis frame on my 1100 evo.

Thought about getting the exhaust black ceramic coated...?
Dam nice job done btw           [coffee]

Brian

I know you guys only like Monsters  ;D but here is a couple of pics of the Sport Classic frame I'm currently working on.
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20Sport%20Classic/DSC02210.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20Sport%20Classic/SCFrame1.jpg)

Even tho' it's not a Monster - I'll (sorta)look forward to progress pics ;D

Need a bike to fit it on? 

 ;D

Yes, it will need a home. Could work with any of the SC's depending on some of the brackets.

(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20Sport%20Classic/DSC02221.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/Ducati%20Sport%20Classic/DSC02220.jpg)

How do you keep the air away from the backs of the welds on that tubing when you can't flood the area with argon?

I'd say he's backfilling through that brass QD fitting on the bushing on the top of the steering head tube.

I saw that but didn't quite make the connection.  So, wherever you're going to make a connection, you just drill a hole to let the gas pass through on the inside?

Note to self.

That's what I would do.
I'd also tape up any other unwelded joints to keep the leakage down to a minimum.

But whether that's actually what Randy does, well.... maybe he'll tell us.
Or maybe already has, and I'm remembering.  [laugh]

You guys already figured it out... ;) It's pretty hard to get it everywhere. I know some guys that weld Ti in heat exchangers for a living and they don't worry about the back side of the weld. Just like everything else it depends on who you talk to. If you want maximum strength it needs to be flooded on the back side IMHO.

I agree. Any oxygen that gets to the weld, even the back side, just f's it all up.

Its hard to take a chance on a frame failure at triple digit speeds. You're doing the right thing [thumbsup]

Any updates on the SC Ti frame? That SR4S is a superb work of art.

  It is complete and the owner has had it a couple of months. I should have pics of the completed bike soon. From what I have seen it is amazing! A few of the build pics:

(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/StradaFab/Exhaust26.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/StradaFab/Frame51.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/StradaFab/SCFrame2A.jpg)
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr62/porsche40/StradaFab/SCFrame7A.jpg)

I think I just blew the zipper on my jeans!   [thumbsup] [drool]

I wouldn't even finish that and just hang it in a museum as is.  Simply beautiful.  Deserves a tear:  :'(

  Just wait until you see it complete! It is something else!

Randy, are your fixtures one off? How are you designing the frames, in Cad software?

Nice work btw. I weld bicycle frames and back purge exactly like you do.

  I build the jig to fit a stock frame, so there is no need to re-design anything. The stock frames are very well triangulated and I am not looking to use super thin wall thicknesses like a bicycle frame. On the frame in the picture I did design the mount for the single shock.

How long did the Monster frame take you to finish?
I think this needs to be put into production..

  It takes 4-6 weeks to build one because I never get to work on one until it's done  ;D

WOW Randy, amazing work! Those frames were just mind blowing, I can't express how impress I got...

How did it turn out for the Sports Classic? Have you posted your work on it somewhere else? I love that bike in stock shape, add a titanium frame and it will turn Walt Siegl green of envy!

Once again, amazing job! Congratulations!

G

what do you do about the title for these frames?

  I issue a MSO and put a serial number on the frame. Your local DMV will issue a VIN.

Looks well made, very nice.

Sadly in Australia, to get a government issued VIN on a custom frame requires lots of patience and deep pockets.  To get the WHOLE vehicle certified as compliant requires a State licensed engineer to certify everything on the bike such as various breaking distances, headlights, brake hoses, exhaust, rake, trail etc, I've been advised there's no change from $7k and that's just for the compliance work.  The $300 in tubing, tig media and time is nothing compared to the compliance cost to get a custom framed bike on the road.